Episode 004 - Part 2: Interview with Casey Crawford, Co-Founder & CEO Movement Mortgage

Speaker 1: 0:02

Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Grow where God reveals our way. I'm Anjali Gibson, your host, and I can't wait to explore the vast riches of God's Word with you. So don't forget to subscribe and stay tuned for upcoming episodes packed with biblical teachings, inspirational stories and a fresh perspective on the world around us. Now let's get started on this beautiful journey. May God bless you abundantly. Welcome back to Grow, where we are diving into part two of my interview with Casey Crawford. We are getting ready to go into what LoveWorks is including, where Casey was sharing a story about his friend Mike. That's truly inspirational. Let's take a listen.

Speaker 2: 0:51

I would love to hear a story. So again, we're talking about all the work you and your team are doing, loving God, loving people, and one facet of that is, through what you just described, loveworks, and it's caring for those in the inner circle and then starting to love out. Can you give us a story? You shared a story about a fellow teammate that you have. I remember you saying he was kind of rough in nature maybe, and just his pathway through living these small acts of love out, how it actually leads to eternal reward. Do you mind sharing a story?

Speaker 3: 1:36

Sure, yes. So there's three real big pillars of ways we try to walk that I've tried to kind of guess. Maybe walk out my faith and express it culturally in movement. And again, all of them, all of them, I really want to be invitations, just like invitations to people into a community that loves and values one another and then, if they're open to it, if they're interested in it, through that process comes to know a God who loves them so passionately, beyond maybe what they could even imagine. And LoveWorks is one of those.

Speaker 3: 2:09

First, it's kind of a benevolence fund, would be the equivalent of the church, just to say, hey, we're going to care for each other. And then we said that we hope that we've cared for each other. Gosh, let's get a bigger picture of the world. Let's get a bigger picture of the world. Let's realize, man, especially in the United States, we can get a really really ethnic center kind of small picture of the world sometimes. So let's be intentional to go out around the world and meet some new friends living in some sometimes like some really difficult, challenging places that have a faith and like that might be just really stretching to us. And so we started doing what we call vision trips. And we said, you know what? We're going to try to expand our vision of what the world looks like and how we can impact it in meaningful ways. And there's no precursor to these trips, it's not for people of faith and not a faith or people of courage, right? They say, okay, I'm going to expand my vision.

Speaker 3: 2:57

And so my partner, toby Harris, organized a trip to Guatemala, and Guatemala, off the coast, is known for good fishing and so Toby loves to fish. He called a few guys saying, hey, you guys want to go fish with me in Guatemala for a few days. And guys say, yeah, love to go fish, love to go. He said, okay, we're going to go visit a couple of friends down there that are building a couple of things and then we're going to go off shore. And the guy said, okay, you know, sent out was great.

Speaker 3: 3:18

And so one of those is our now president, a guy named Mike Brandon, who's an incredible, just incredible friend, incredible brother in Christ I just absolutely love dearly. And you know, mike, mike was a guy he kind of said he had been to you know service a couple of times. Maybe growing up race Catholic kind of went Christmas and Easter or two or three times. That was it. He's like man. I knew who. Movement was a new case. He was. He's a person of faith and I just went. That's great, that's great. I'm all about like a good moral company. I like that.

Speaker 3: 3:47

Mike's got, you know, two tat sleeves up up and down both arms. I think he had 20 something felonies before he was 18 or at 18. Like it says some crazy number, I don't know how you get a funny four 18, but it was a pretty wild thing. And he described this like man. I was just a kid, it was not bad stuff, it was just, but like the guy's just wide open, right, but fully courage. He said, yes, I'm going, and he now calls that the NAFTA trip. So not a fishing trip after all. Or he'll say, if it was a fishing trip, I was the catch.

Speaker 3: 4:19

But you know, mike went down to Guatemala with my partner Toby was like you know half a dozen other teammates and before their fishing trip they went and visited some villages and with a group called ICM and they they built hope centers in these villages. I said I see him did this, the work that they did. And Toby had done some work with ICM and he said you know, mike, I want you to see this. And so they went to a village and they met some local leaders. They met a pastor of a little little little village and there was not a permanent structure in the village and Mike was looking around at poverty that he'd never seen or experienced. And then he met a young, 13 year old girl who had walked to that village for some number of miles and the pastor's introducing her and Mike was just kind of undone by this girl's faith. And he goes, man. She was telling me things about her faith and I couldn't understand them and process them and he started to ask the pastor why is she coming? He goes well, she's coming to help build this hope center because it's. It's a big deal for this whole community. And Mike, you know why is it such a big deal? He goes well, in Guatemala, on average, girls for age are going to be pregnant by the time of the 13 or 14 years old and it's from non-consensual sex and it's kind of cultural but without a permanent structure for them to sleep in a safe place for them to go to school as an orphanage, a church, on Sundays. That's what she's headed towards and she knows that and the whole community knows that. But when we want to change that, mike was just undone. Those are human right. This is a human being, a precious little girl who's smart and bright and all all you know hope in her eyes.

Speaker 3: 5:51

And Mike's saying how much are these to build? And he was actually with three Christians and Mike would at that time call himself not a person of faith at all. The pastor told him so you know they're about $25,000. Mike looked at the three guys with him and, as a typical sales guys, he's Every one of you in that first can put that on an am ex card. I know how much. I know how much you make. Okay, put your cards in the bowl. We're all gonna build one. We're gonna build four of these and the guys the world's gotten into.

Speaker 3: 6:22

Mike. And Mike came back from that trip me, told me the case I needed me with your breakfast, me, oh man, I, we come down and he's just, he's tears his eyes. He says I need to understand. I know you're a person of faith and I need to understand, like what this little girl's fates about. I don't get it. I don't get it, like I don't understand. And and your shirt asked me these really easy questions, like you know why the bad things happen to good people all like.

Speaker 3: 6:45

But Mike was like convicted to build these churches just out of the human need. And so Mike Kitted that he was gonna see a hope center built in every village in Guatemala in the next five years. Not a person of faith at that time, like not a person of faith at all at that time and but was exploring an issue, but just knew that this is the kind of like like I can't unsee this and I can't not move and cannot act. And he actually began Inspired people that were saying, hey, I'm a follower of Christ and deep faith to actually be generous and get involved in this Lead. I mean, he's led dozens of trips to Guatemala and he had built 200 hope centers in villages in Guatemala kind of that, are inspired and organized to have them built. And before he finally came to faith, and, and, and it clicked for him in a conversation with John Maxwell and they went, they went Golfing and John's one of the greatest evangelists in the world.

Speaker 3: 7:32

He kind of explains that the gospel, the Mike, in a way that I just never could figure out how to and might call me, and so this has got to be the way Peter came to faith. Right, mike calls me. I mean my wife from Jersey also loved, I loved my Jersey Pete and Mike Mike goes a case. Yeah, he's crying, just I finally get it. It's all about nothing, jesus. He didn't say a thing. He's all about everything. Jesus, like even try to tell me Like I pray to receive Jesus, a follow-up Jesus, like I'm, and it was just such a beautiful like submission he goes. And, by the way, I'm getting baptized at the first church I ever built. By what? The whole epic company to come. Actually, you know this is not what it looks like on Sunday morning at a lot of our now like proper south or something.

Speaker 3: 8:17

But man, it was what it looks like when somebody just encounters a lover, christ. When they step out a little bit in faith, they start walking alongside guys and doing the work that he does to me and love and serve the marginalized and it's been. It's been an incredible, beautiful transfer. I don't know how many people like him a faith through. A 65 teammates did fly down there. Mike's wife actually stood up to get baptized as well. Two teammates and a teammate Don't stood up to get baptized along with Mike in the river alongside you ever built and that pastor is a friend of this day and Mike still goes down there and visits him.

Speaker 3: 8:48

And you know, we got Literally have hundreds of stories like that of people they start kind of walking the stuff out in the workplace with friends, step out on mission and and the larger change like way and whether they come to faith or whatever that looks like like everybody comes back better, everyone comes back on. Wow, I'm in my life's richer, and that's what I say. People say thanks for going and they may always come back to go. Oh, my gosh, you know I received like I received, like I got to meet people who are walking with courage that I can't imagine. I got to. I get to, you know, see, people are processing decisions that that make mine back here just seem heady and insignificant and that that's actually A gift that take my eyes off of myself and think about man, all that I have not, all that I don't have, like you know, I'm thinking about that. And so, yeah, we see people live transformed in those love works and vision trips.

Speaker 3: 9:39

And and then finally, I needed to put a thing in place. When Mike, mike was coming back from these vision trips, we had other teammates come back with these hard, hard questions. I'm like life and faith, that's going man, I don't know. I'm sure listeners feel this way sometimes too, like I don't. I'm not Billy Graham, I'm not, you know, I'm having, having graduated seminary with all the equipping and to answer all these really tough questions on faith and explain everything to folks. But others have, others have, and so I actually invited a really good friend of mine who has a doctorate in a theology that helped write some curriculum for us to just like answer the hard questions in life, you know, and discuss them and process them and then you answer them is probably the wrong phrase, but discuss them and explore with them. There aren't great answers for these things, but there are a lot of truths that we can learn, particularly when we process with some other. And so he wrote a curriculum called movement mentoring, where we just process life's questions together in small groups and just kind of shared vulnerably and authentically.

Speaker 3: 10:36

And that happens, I think, more robustly in the workplace than I ever experienced in the church. Cause at work again, I'm doing 40, 50, 60 hours a week, right, and people know what I'm acting like. Like I can fake anyone out for an hour at church Pretty much, unless I'm in like the worst, hardest time of my life. I can smile and high five. We don't even know. You see me across the, you know sanctuary or something, or even doing a small group, sometimes one hour. Our lives are intertwined. When you're working together, man, your lives are like locked in and you just so. When you start processing these harder questions in life, you know the purpose of it, the meaning and these things. With people that you do that much life with, I think you get to more honest answers more quickly and that's a good thing. That's a really, really good and powerful thing. And so we've seen I mean we've had thousands of teammates now go through small group mentoring groups together such a process in life's big questions. That's been up.

Speaker 2: 11:33

No, that's so good and we hear all the time truth sets people free, and the thing about the truth setting people free is we actually have to be courageous enough to confront the truth Like what are the fears and the worries and the things, the hurts that are in our heart that need to be brought forward so God can heal those things. So I love the notion of mentoring and really just creating space to help people live intentionally, on purpose, on mission, as you described it, in their best form of themselves, right, Really cultivating who God created them to be. It's just absolutely fantastic. Want to move from love works, the mentoring, the vision trips that facet of how you're loving God and loving people to the schools. So you've talked about the schools a couple of times just for folks who don't know what are the schools and how many of them have you been able to stand up so far.

Speaker 3: 12:37

Yeah. So kind of part of our vision again, just like four employees that, hey, you know, want to love each other, love and serve our customers, and if we've created a profit doing that, which we hope we would, wouldn't it be neat to like take that profit and reinvest in the communities we're a part of? Didn't know how, didn't know what we would do with that or how we would do it. We just started and we pivoted a couple of times. We started doing some.

Speaker 3: 12:55

We did an affordable housing project with single moms, that we did a community center and then, as God kind of blessed the business, the business crew, we had more capital and more opportunities and we landed on schools charter one title one, charter schools that are exclusively built to serve the most marginalized in our community, the poorest kids in our community. It's been absolutely outstanding. We really researched what are the things that are going to change kids lives. With the largest amount of impact and overwhelmingly the largest statistical correlate to a kid escaping poverty in their lifetime is whether or not they can read at grade level in third grade. Interestingly, we also build our prisons in America based on the number of boys they can read in third grade.

Speaker 2: 13:41

Oh my gosh, that is crazy.

Speaker 3: 13:44

It is. It's a pretty tough statistic to when you process that on average, in like in Charlton, north Carolina which is not this summer from a lot of other big cities 98% of our kiddos that are born in poverty will die in poverty. So you imagine being a single mom with three kids and you know to your boys and they can't read a grade level, you know there's a person self-past to be involved one of them, and that there's a 98% like less than 2% Likely that your kid is are going to be the ones that are able to to matriculate out of poverty in their life. And that's just statistics. Right, that's statistics. And so you can look at them. They hey, there's either something like deficient with the kiddo or there's like something deficient with the systems and the culture and the values around them. We believe many skid there's nothing wrong with these kids, like there is absolutely nothing wrong with these kids. They're great and image of God they are. They have fearfully, wonderfully made gosh. They have so much ridiculous potential. But there are a lot of there, a lot of Challenges they have, particularly in the education system, that are keeping them from realizing that full potential. So we looked at the institutions that were changing that most dramatically. And we looked at housing, because we're in Mortgages and it was not housing. And we looked at health care and I've a great friend runs a massive Medicare business. We look at it really stated in depth, it is not health care. And we looked at the institution of education and overwhelmingly, this institution of education provided the largest opportunity right to pour into kids pre-k through sixth grade and Equip them with the tools they need to fully use all those gifts to break out of poverty and Sliv of life. I think the God has come in a much more meaningful way.

Speaker 3: 15:14

So then we started going okay, if it's education, who's doing this? Well, how do you do education? Well, we run around the US trying to find some of the best practitioners of Bringing education into to the urban poor and breaking some of these cycles of poverty, and Turns out one of them was right here on backyard, cheryl Turner, running a great school called Sugar Creek. And you know it was a long, interesting story, but we got. We got really passionate about it. So start building schools.

Speaker 3: 15:40

We ended up hiring an incredible CEO of movement schools named Kerry Antonisha Thomas, who was coming down from New York after in the best schools in New York and we intersected her and she was almost gonna be out, like she was almost gonna be out. She's. She's incredibly packed. She's with the 14 public schools growing up and graduated Topper class from Columbia and then was one of the most successful educators in the state of New York, was born out. She saw what we were doing. She got reinvigorated and she said you know what, if you will build Great schools, I will fill them up with amazing kids and amazing teachers. And she's done exactly that. So we've committed to build a hundred title one charter schools over the next eight years. Now only got eight years.

Speaker 3: 16:19

Left Was 10. We started. We started the 10-year vision. We're kind of kind of doing a geometric multiplication strategy and we are. We are at five schools open and active right now. We have four more coming out of the ground next year and we're opening in Atlanta, charleston and Raleigh Next year.

Speaker 3: 16:39

And it's just been. It's been absolutely incredible to see what these kids have done. Our kids are now having, on average, about 50% of them are reading at grade level, which KT would would would jazz ties me for celebrating, but when, when you're comparing that to like 15 to 20 percent of their demographic peers reading at grade level. It's a celebration, it's progress. Now she is correct and I don't argue with her ever. But our kids are capable of 90% Like that. 90% of them are gonna be reading a grade level when we do the work that we need to do to get from there. But, ma'am, we're thankful for the progress and we think we're giving kids an opportunity at home. And then we, you know, we can wrap those schools around with after-school services, with weekend services for mom, for dad, for for caretakers. We have counseling at every school and we're actually are putting medical in most of the schools Also, just get to help the medical.

Speaker 3: 17:28

And what we want, angelique, is two things. One, we know God's called us to do this, right. We know all this to like, love the margin lots, particularly kiddos, and you know scale and we're pretty good at scale things. So so we're doing it in that way and he's given me as the capacity to do so. So walk in that. But what we're doing only an example like a hundred schools doesn't solve the problem in two or three states, right? What we want to do is go first and live into our name of being a movement, and so we say, hey, we're going to model out for folks what it can look like improve out in our nation.

Speaker 3: 17:59

So many of our problems in our country are locked up in the bottom 10% of earners in our country.

Speaker 3: 18:05

There's just so many problems that are associated with poverty.

Speaker 3: 18:07

Life gets so hard if you're living in poverty and as followers of Jesus, I think we are supposed to be like leading the charge at the tip of the spear, to like run to our neighbors in poverty and think about how to love and serve them in a way that doesn't just like throw a fish or like throw a meal, but it's like actually comes alongside folks, partners with them, so they can use all the gifts God's given them to have like a flourishing, thriving life, so that we have stronger communities, stronger city, a stronger nation over time.

Speaker 3: 18:35

And so we're trying to do our part to be kind of the tip of the spear of that and improve out this model with schools and then give it away. Just give it away to anyone that'll take it. We run our schools 100% inside of state and federal dollars. So it truly it does take capital to build a school and all that kind of thing, but we're running it like a business so that it's sustainable and scalable and can be replicated, hopefully, across the US. That's just the contribution we want to make into our country to improve out these kids have everything that they need and we want to break down any kind of you know, subtle racism that exists to say, hey, these kids somehow are deficient or can't do that. We know that's not the case. We're going to prove that out the kids are proving that out and and then give people a model for how to do this more robustly and more scale so more kids can experience that hope, break those chains of poverty.

Speaker 2: 19:22

That's absolutely incredible. You know, I love the notion of rinse, leather, repeat, and so a lot of really good work has gone into figuring this out and being able to leverage what you all have paved the way on and just continue to be multipliers, like the numbers of multiplication across our communities is what's needed. So I'm going to share a lot more detail and the show notes on how people can learn more about not only what we've talked about today, but there's so much more that you all are doing that is just really good to dig into just one, I think. What can you do today? Take a step, love the person sitting next to you right? That's call number one. And then, through faithfulness, when you're faithful to those around you, god will continue to open doors to do more, and so I'm hoping that you're catching.

Speaker 2: 20:15

Those who are listening are catching some of the vision that Casey is casting for our community. What could Charlotte look like if you're in Charlotte? What could it look like if we truly did love our neighbor as we love the Lord, if we really lived it out? What could New York start to look like? Or Chicago, or the cities that are literally just crumbling within? They need the love of Christ. So we are the love of Christ. We are to bring the light to the city on the hill Before we go.

Speaker 2: 20:46

I also want to cast a little bit more vision to marketplace leaders. So, whether it's a CEO of a company or someone in a leadership role thinking about creative, creatively, how do people have roles that actually are established with almost love? Ambassadors in the community. And when I was reading up on some of the roles that you've established inside a movement mortgage, casey, a couple of them caught my eye. I was just love to hear your take on what these roles are. So it really is providing inspiration to other people to maybe even do the same in their organizations. And I'll just call out a few you have a chief pastoral officer Super interesting, that's not typical in a business A Christian counselor, a social worker. So let's just do those three.

Speaker 2: 21:42

Those are three roles that exist in community, but not typically a business.

Speaker 3: 21:48

So I'd be quick to say, like we do, we have like 5,000 team members, right? So business has a certain amount of scale and things. These are not things we had day one, right, these are not things we had. There's certainly not needed day one. I think a lot of people say, well, we only have 20 employees. I can't afford a pastor, goodness gracious, of course you can't, but that would make no sense in the world.

Speaker 3: 22:07

Like, I started to have a problem myself like with being able to like walk more deeply with people with questions they had about faith. And it was such. It was such because of our culture, because of our vision trips, because of all that we do. Man, it was just a resounding need inside the community. And so our foundation decided to fund a person to kind of process a lot of those questions with and build us some curriculum and do all those things. And it's been outstanding. He actually doesn't like all the time being called the pastor off, because that's like Christians love that phrase and a lot of people aren't don't, and that's really important. And so we're yeah, we're pretty sensitive to that that his role will be one that is like a blessing to everybody in the organization and so like he's very intentional to create a lot of values based curriculum as well. That's something around like love, courage, humility, care, empathy, all that kind of stuff. We process a lot of those kinds of questions in community as well. So that's the first one. The Christian counseling one is we have Christian counseling and agnostic I guess, karen, I'm not agnostic, but secular counseling as well.

Speaker 3: 23:17

But a lot of our folks are people of faith inside of our community and they really want that connected. And it's when you start thinking about the emotional wellness and the productivity of your folks. I think I can make absolutely I know I can make an argument that organizations are far more productive when their folks are emotionally healthy and spiritually healthy. And so, yeah, we invest in it. You know it's an investment, I think it's, I think it's one with really good returns.

Speaker 3: 23:40

Right, it's not, it's not what again this is? This is something like, oh, that's so nice of you to do. Well, actually, very selfishly, I really want to have a high performing organization. Our folks are way more high performing when they are like really healthy emotionally, spiritually, relationally, and like me, first and foremost, they're like I think, advantage of these services like robustly. Okay, amen, we, we, you know we all need these things, and I think, again, that's probably the theme throughout all of this is just trying to build a community that I'd want to be a part of, or I want my kiddos to be able to be a part of, right? So so there's a again that very selfish theme in there, I guess.

Speaker 2: 24:12

And then finally- it's God's desire God. God created community right.

Speaker 3: 24:16

Absolutely, absolutely. You walk in there and you're like man, this is this, feels so good and so healthy. That's right. And the other associate worker was one like our Love Works program, dimea. I met with her yesterday, actually an amazing woman that has a huge heart for people and is so gifted.

Speaker 3: 24:32

Again, our Love Works program got to be of the size and scope that that you know, with hundreds of teammate taking advantage of it. We don't just want to dole out capital, right. A lot of times there's emotional support that's needed, there's, there's, there's, you know, plugged into the right programs. And so we got somebody who's like an absolute expert at that to really not just dole out dollars but, like love serve, walk alongside our teammates that were in times of need, you know, so that they didn't come back in at that time and didn't fall, you know like, didn't fall back into the ditch, and she's just incredible at doing that, has a team now that helps her.

Speaker 3: 25:01

We have a lot, of a lot of folks volunteer. We have spouses, that kind of go. I don't really work, I'm not full time, but I'd love to do something. A lot of those folks volunteer on our Love Works team and then they thought like, oh my gosh, I'm like full time again, cause this is like really hard way. It is Like really really hard work. I mean, we've been been alive for a while, it's a lot of work and so she leads that whole team and helps to equip that team with, you know, strategies and techniques to, to, to, to sort of folks to help get their life back on track. So it's, yeah, those are, those are. Those are a little bit different, I guess, roles than every every corporation, but they're ones. I think again, I would make a really strong business argument that any business should like probably benefit in investing in like healthy relationships in the lives of their folks, you get a lot more productive and a lot more yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 25:45

Amen, well said. So, just as we wrap up here, is there anything else that you would just want to share with the listeners that you feel like is still on your heart? Just release it, or you feel like you have said what God has called you to say today.

Speaker 3: 26:00

Yeah, I hope you've said it. I think the biggest thing I would just say like start taking a step. You know you can already say like taking a step of faith, and it's usually one that's a little scary. I've just found like the faithful one is usually a little bit scary because I think we have an enemy. I think people believe like Satan does not want us to enjoy the life that God has for us or to pursue God's paths for our life, and so he does things to discourage us and to let fear in our heart and make things seem silly. And so you know, if there's something you're feeling like led to do, but it's a little scary, it feels a little silly maybe, or just a little bit sacrificial, even like, oh man, I'd like to give, but I don't know like I also like that new car over there and that would mean this trade off.

Speaker 3: 26:41

Gosh, just take that leap of faith Like step out, step out in some small way, just step out in some small stretch yourself in some small way. Step out and just watch God meet you there, and I promise like on the front end, for me it always feels terrifying and fearful. Oh gosh, can I do this? And then you look back, man. You look back and what was such fear in your heart, man? You just see God's faithfulness, like right here he meets that fear with such incredible faithfulness.

Speaker 3: 27:07

And you look back and just almost feel silly. Right, it's a testimony in the story you write from. Those little leaps of faith that are so filled with fear are just incredible. They're just incredible. So on this side of the action I know it probably feels fearful and it still does for me, like I, just every week something probably comes up like oh gosh, I don't know, we do this podcast, we do this thing. But take that little, small step out in faith and watch God meet you there, just expand your faith in him and the day to joy you have and fall in them, as he kind of weaves and works out his story throughout history of love and redeem in a broken heart and world.

Speaker 2: 27:41

Amen. Well, well said. Well, we just thank you for your time, casey. This has just been an incredible conversation and I know that the listeners are just inspired with new hope, new vision and how to really put love into action, carried into the marketplace, and really help our community become a better place. Would you do us the honor of closing us out in prayer?

Speaker 3: 28:01

I will. And I want just to thank you too, angelique, because you know this podcast itself. Maybe somebody clicking on this podcast was an active faith, but you being willing to lead and invest the time and energy to do this with such excellence is it's a great testament, it's a great encouragement to all. So thank you for your faithfulness and it's great to connect with you as a new friend.

Speaker 3: 28:18

We'll pray, heavenly Father, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, lord, for the great gift of Jesus, for his love for us, for while we were yet sinners and hate you, lord, you sent your son to die for us Like that his blood would pay the atonement for our sin. Father, we just take hold out of prayer at every listener would take hold that they'd know that hope, they'd know that, oh, this is that freedom that is in Christ Lord, not pray. That, compelled by that freedom, that free gift of salvation in Christ Lord, that we would act and join. Act in faith, lord, to follow your lead of loving a hurting world or running people maybe that are far from us, that even opposed to his father the way you ran to us, and that would pour out our lives, lord, and with a passion to see others come to know the hope that we have in you. Thank you for your love for us. Lord, lead us, guide us for your glory, jesus' name amen.

Speaker 1: 29:12

Thank you for joining us on this episode of Grow where God reveals our way. We hope you found inspiration, wisdom and encouragement as we continue on this faith-filled journey together. We invite you to subscribe to Grow so you never miss an episode. Stay tuned for more biblical teachings, heartfelt testimonies and insights that will nourish your spirit in deep in your relationship with God. We appreciate your support and participation in this podcast. Until next time, may you grow in faith, love and knowledge of his divine plan. May God bless you abundantly.